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adams66
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Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 1:25 pm |
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| Posts: 42Location: essex, ukJoined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 9:30 am
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K-Tel's Best Of Bowie was my very first Bowie album, and I still think it was a very good compilation. But since 1980 I've been curious as to why "Breaking Glass" was included where it was. I realise that "Drive In Saturday" should have followed "The Jean Genie" in the running order but does anyone know why the non-chronological live version of "Breaking Glass" replaced it? It must have been a last minute decision too, judging by the fact that some sleeves had to be stickered to reflect the change.
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ruud
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Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 4:12 pm |
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| Site AdminPosts: 812Location: UitgeestJoined: Thu Dec 28, 2006 12:00 am
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Who has dictated that Drive-In Saturday should be replaced with Breaking Glass will probably remain a mystery. Fact is that even some LPs were pressed containing Drive-In Saturday, see the Vinyl discography. I concur that Best Of Bowie remained as essential compilation album long after it had been superseded by RCA compilations. It's also a fascinating album in the sense that the track listing (regarding editions/versions) differed so much between territories. And it still is the only Bowie compilation featuring the single edit of Fame... The current list of editions is far from complete. I urge everybody to scrutinize their copy and upload it if there are differences!
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adams66
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Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 5:01 pm |
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| Posts: 42Location: essex, ukJoined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 9:30 am
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I had no idea that some pressings actually included "Drive In Saturday". So the substitution must have come very late in the day!
But what possesed someone to use "Breaking Glass" - I mean why not "Rebel Rebel" (which is a surprising omission in the first place, and wouldn't have been too out of line chronologically), or even something like "Changes" - but "Breaking Glass"???
And yes, an awful lot of fiddling around was done between territories. All the more surprising when you consider that K-Tel was a budget sort of label and one that you'd imagine wouldn't have the resources, or any interest, in changing things around.
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shooky
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Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2012 6:31 am |
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Posts: 1774Location: takasaki, japanJoined: Wed May 28, 2008 11:20 am
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you also have to wonder why Drive-In Saturday wasn't included on ChangesOneBowie, ChangesTwoBowie or Fame And Fashion (it was a #3 UK single). perhaps RCA vetoed its inclusion on the K-Tel set also. could someone with a UK copy confirm whether the clumsy tight edit between John I'm Only Dancing and The Jean Genie is the same as found on the South African issue? choice of edits/versions appears to be consistent but this is really sloppy... i've just A/B'd the (sax) version on the UK ChangesOneBowie LP and the BoB cut "wins" but for that lousy edit (almost 4 seconds of the fade are lopped off). it's been suggested elsewhere (couldn't find the post) that the master tape for the loud mix of Starman went to K-Tel and it's a solid theory considering how good it sounds on this comp.
Last edited by shooky on Sun Aug 05, 2012 3:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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adams66
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Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2012 8:42 pm |
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| Posts: 42Location: essex, ukJoined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 9:30 am
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Re the edit between "John" and "Jean" - my first copy of this album was on cassette and I thought it was brilliant how the end of "John" suddenly crashed into "Jean", so certainly the UK cassette had this edit.
In fact I always think "Jean Genie" ought to crash in at the end of that Ronno freak out as, certainly as far as I thought, the edit worked really well.
Interesting that "Drive In Saturday" was so ill-served by the old compilations. I wonder why that was?
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ruud
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Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2012 10:12 pm |
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| Site AdminPosts: 812Location: UitgeestJoined: Thu Dec 28, 2006 12:00 am
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Matt, this is the edit I know from all copies including the sax version. I concur with Richard that it works well (even if we miss a few seconds from JIOD), there's a good flow.
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shooky
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Posted: Sun Aug 05, 2012 12:47 am |
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Posts: 1774Location: takasaki, japanJoined: Wed May 28, 2008 11:20 am
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brilliant? no problem if it had been a proper segue (the tail of the JIOD fade running into Jean Genie) or there was no gap at all, but to have that abrupt stop and a tiny gap? very amateur editing IMO.
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paleblinds
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Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 1:58 pm |
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| Posts: 145Location: Brighton (UK)Joined: Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:38 pm
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STOP PRESS! MISSING LINK! Much happiness in this Jones household (no I didn,t name son David) for this punt on ebay. Have in my hands French pressing (via USA) that actually plays Drive in Saturday but the excitement does not end there. Side 2 Plays:- Diamond Dogs / Beauty and the Beast / Breaking Glass (Live) / Fame /Golden Years / TVC15 / Sound and Vision / Heroes / Boys Keep Swinging. This drops Young AmericansIdentical labels as earliest French Pressing on Disk with the track listing that are wrong for this pressing. Matrix stamped Side 1 M6 335050 2 YPARTX 88314 1 and scratched proceeded by backwards J BLP 81001 A / Side 2 M6 335051 2 YPARTX 88314 1 J BLP 81001 B Please owners of French pressing look at your matrix numbers for difference. Came in early UK cover (don't know why could be former owner) but has french inner dust cover. Some guesses 1, early test pressing (later mislabeled). 2, longer length of side 2 may be original reason for strange edits. 3, The early art department where obviously given the new running order of side 2 but the old one for side 1 Forgive me for not yet posting times of tracks but info will come over the week. Original Ad $9.99 plus postage! Quote: - The Best Of David Bowie 1981 French LP, K-Tel
Sleeve VG+.
Vinyl M-. Several tracks on this album are listed wrong or are in the wrong place.
On side 1 track seven is listed as Breaking Glass but it plays Drive-In Saturday. On side 2 track 2 is listed as Young Americans but it plays Beauty And The Beast On side 2 track 3 is listed as Fame but it plays Breaking Glass (Live) On side 2 track 4 is listed as Golden Years but it plays Fame From there it plays in the order of the listing, but it is of by one in the count.
Last edited by paleblinds on Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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shooky
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Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:06 pm |
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Posts: 1774Location: takasaki, japanJoined: Wed May 28, 2008 11:20 am
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nice find!
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ruud
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Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 4:13 pm |
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| Site AdminPosts: 812Location: UitgeestJoined: Thu Dec 28, 2006 12:00 am
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Intriguing find indeed. A test pressing probably would come with dedicated labels, so I assume it's a mispress.
I think the French edition is the only actually playing different songs (rather than versions). Anybody any clue why?
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shooky
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Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 4:20 pm |
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Posts: 1774Location: takasaki, japanJoined: Wed May 28, 2008 11:20 am
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incorrectly marked tapes and uninformed engineers i expect. same scenario as the french London Boys/LYTT single (that plays There Is A Happy Land/London Boys) and the Lifetimes Rebel Rebel/Queen Bitch (that plays Song For Bob Dylan) among others...
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paleblinds
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Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 7:25 pm |
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| Posts: 145Location: Brighton (UK)Joined: Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:38 pm
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Quote: Intriguing find indeed. A test pressing probably would come with dedicated labels, so I assume it's a mispress. Could be but this pressing isn't a mistake. By its side 1 it is clearly an earlier project and side two having Breaking Glass makes more sense. The plates to manufacture this disc cost money to make so at some point was deliberate. I find it easier to believe this disc was put in, by mistake, with the main batch for final labeling and maybe not picked up that it was earlier test pressing. At some point it ended up in UK record Sleeve so who knows what it came out of the factory in. There must be others out there! The Matrix no's on French pressings would help. Quote: incorrectly marked tapes and uninformed engineers i expect. same scenario as the french London Boys/LYTT single (that plays There Is A Happy Land/London Boys) and the Lifetimes Rebel Rebel/Queen Bitch (that plays Song For Bob Dylan) among others... Its not really like a single mispressing as a tape needs to be edited together to make the plates even with Golden Years/ TVC15 slightly out of place it makes more sense to have Breaking Glass on side 2. Am I correct that regardless of Sleeves or Labels, all versions so far listed in many counties actually play either. 1, North European track listing (UK/France etc) 2, South European (Italy) 3, Australasian (Australia/NZ) But none have actually played Drive In Saturday or the side 2 I have described?
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shooky
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Posted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 12:34 am |
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Posts: 1774Location: takasaki, japanJoined: Wed May 28, 2008 11:20 am
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paleblinds wrote: Its not really like a single mispressing as a tape needs to be edited together to make the plates my point is that if the tapes were mislabelled and the engineer didn't know his bowie, it could explain why the tracks don't match what's on the cover. you're right that it could have been an early, rejected version, but test pressings don't magically find themselves inserted into a pile of regular LPs. everything's automated and done in production-line mode by the thousand. what's more likely is that a batch escaped with this pressing and once discovered were withdrawn and replaced. if the discovery was made early enough only a few would have been sold before being recalled. matrix numbers will definitely help identify the different issues, so hopefully more (or none) will now surface and a clearer picture of the rarity will emerge. could you provide full track info (version/edit etc.)... i'm interested to know if the full Beauty and the Beast is included (intro noise intact?) among others...
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paleblinds
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 2:17 am |
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| Posts: 145Location: Brighton (UK)Joined: Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:38 pm
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No excitement. Beauty and the Beast is the full original album (intro noise intact) and Drive in Saturday is full track. All other tracks (bar young Americans which is not included) are as per the Northern Europe (UK France etc.). However the difference throughout is the speed of the tracks which makes them all shorter. Most by 2-3 seconds but Drive in Saturday and Diamond Dogs are both concluded about 7 seconds early. The speed up on Sound and vision is very small so each track is speeded up at a different rate. From needle drop to arm coming up Side 1 is 29mins 41secs but at proper speed would have exceeded 30 mins, Side2 comes in at 31mins 17 secs but should probably be about 10 secs short of 32 mins. I measured these against my UK copy of Best Of Bowie and RCA CDs for confirmation of speed up. KTel were famous for speeding up and editing in the push, if possible, to get 20 Golden Greats but their mark per side was usually around 30 mins instead of the more advisable 22 mins max. I wonder If Ktel or Bowie's Management decided this didn't pass quality control? Quote: but test pressings don't magically find themselves inserted into a pile of regular LPs. everything's automated and done in production-line mode Shooky you have lived in Japan to long. I am sure this efficiency is available there but these are Gallic blue collar workers just after the 70s! I spend my summer most years among our French friends, in their wonderful country, and anything is possible. FOOT NOTE The Italian 3.02 Diamond Dogs edit would have bought side 2 back under the magic 30 mins but I have no basis for this conjecture other than the question why else?
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shooky
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 2:38 am |
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Posts: 1774Location: takasaki, japanJoined: Wed May 28, 2008 11:20 am
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speed up is done for the reasons you describe. any record over 22 mins a side is compromised sonically, usually in volume. from an audiophile point of view, cramming 10 songs per side is reason enough to avoid a purchase. but these kinds of compilations were aimed at casual fans, the kind who shop for records at Woolworth when picking up stationery for the new school term. from a collector point of view there are edits and there are edits... personally, speeding up a track to make it fit barely constitutes a "unique edit" claim, but fading songs early is just as lazy. more creative editing (e.g. K-Tel's Diamond Dogs, the Oz TVC15) make things a bit more interesting once we've run out of things to get excited about.
i'd guess the Italian DD is laziness, a simple fix to cram it all on to one side.
vinyl manufacture is the same the world over... the idea that the French wing of K-tel was sipping wine between each cut and someone slipped a test pressing into a pile of stock records is a fantasy. it'll all have been done in a controlled environment by staff in white gloves and hair nets the way it's been done forever.
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